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AMD vs Intel. Fight!

 
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DanRRight



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 2235
Location: South Pole, Antarctica

PostPosted: Tue Jan 07, 2020 2:56 am    Post subject: AMD vs Intel. Fight! Reply with quote

Ian Cutress from Anandtech is preparing test of new AMD 64-core processor, see

"AMD’s 64-Core Threadripper 3990X, only $3990! Coming February 7th"

Let's prepare for him the test which we have tried here few years back where we used linear algebra AX=B dense matrix as an example (used MKL/Pardiso and LAIPE parallel libraries).

Now from ver 19 i think Intel MKL/Pardiso libraries support AVX512 and if AMD will beat Intel processors using Intel's own software the game for Intel with its 10x overpriced processors is over. AMD has huge chance doing that because its large caches even though it supports only SSE256. And the 8-channel memory on another 64core AMD cheaper than Intel processor called EPYC 7002 has chance to beat Intel even more

Here is an example mecej4 wrote for MKL library back then. We just need to compile it with new MKL library on any compiler which will support AVX512 and sent it to Ian

Code:

 implicit none
 integer :: i,j,neq,nrhs=1,lda,ldb, info
 real*8,allocatable :: A(:,:),b(:)
 integer, allocatable :: piv(:)
 Integer count_0, count_1, count_rate, count_max
 

 do neq=1000,21000,5000
    lda=neq; ldb=neq
    allocate(A(neq,neq),b(neq),piv(neq))
    call random_number(A)
    call random_number(b)
    Call system_clock(count_0, count_rate, count_max)
    CALL dgesv (nEq,nrhs,A,ldA,piv, b, ldb, info)
    Call system_clock(count_1, count_rate, count_max)
    Write (*, '(1x,A,i6,A,2x,F8.3,A)') 'nEqu = ',nEq,' ', &
         dble(count_1-count_0)/count_rate, ' s'
    deallocate(A,b,piv)

 end do
 end
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JohnCampbell



Joined: 16 Feb 2006
Posts: 2239
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2020 8:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan,

I am looking at the Ryzen 9 3900X as a comparison to the i9-10920X or i9-9900KS. Hopefully I might be able to test them to see how single thread and multi-thread performance compare. Yet to fine a test pc.
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DanRRight



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 2235
Location: South Pole, Antarctica

PostPosted: Wed Apr 22, 2020 11:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, would be nice if you play with this. Please use Intel MKL ver.19 or later. It has optimization for AWX512.

My MKL is older, i do not know if Intel distributing MKL for free or not, before for some period of time MKL was free.

After you compile the code with new MKL with and without AVX512 please send it to me, i will try to ask Anandtech dot com guys to run it on different processors which have AVX512.

I do not know if it is possible to activate AVX in AMD processors, they do not have AVX512, but some have AVX256 i think. Not all Intel processors have AVX512 too, but AVX could be a major improvement point with the linear algebra
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JohnCampbell



Joined: 16 Feb 2006
Posts: 2239
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan,

AMD appear to have hit the lead for desktop pc's. I will be trying to buy a Ryzen 5900X, possibly 5950X, when it is generally available. Threadripper looks to be a price point too high, although the extra memory channels may be my next step after this.

OpenMP with 24 threads with large arrays (GB's) looks to be a practical limitation for me at the moment. I am struggling to get AVX2 to work effectively and it is annoying me that I can't approach MKL quoted performance for large arrays. Either marketing spin or my ignorance !
(I would expect AVX512 will only work when arrays are in L1 cache, but again probably my ignorance !)
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DanRRight



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 2235
Location: South Pole, Antarctica

PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do not know why, coronavirus or something else, but you can not buy recently anything from AMD or NVIDIA. Two months after releasing new graphics cards from NVIDIA 3080 and 3090, for example, which will be particularly good with OpenGL, and the only which work with 8k monitors, they are still shown as "sold out" in all shops. You can buy them on eBay but at 2x price. Hope they will appear at least on Black Friday this week. Do you have Black Fridays in Australia?
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LitusSaxonicum



Joined: 23 Aug 2005
Posts: 2187
Location: Yateley, Hants, UK

PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan,

Isn't the answer in your post - people have bought all the stock knowing that they can sell it on for 100% profit. Who can afford to? Someone with a lot of money. What's the betting that the funding comes from a rival with an inferior product?

Eddie
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DanRRight



Joined: 10 Mar 2008
Posts: 2235
Location: South Pole, Antarctica

PostPosted: Mon Nov 23, 2020 1:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good news is that AMD just made graphics card superior to NVIDIA. And INTEL last week showed samples of new processor which will beat AMD scheduled for first quarter of 2021. May be this will cool the craze with the reselling everything on Ebay.
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JohnCampbell



Joined: 16 Feb 2006
Posts: 2239
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 3:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan,

I am hoping to get a Zen 3 Ryzen when stocks become available. Hopefully it will perform well as claimed for large vector calculations. The big problem is availability !
I have read some of the Intel 11 Gen Rocket Lake info, but initially they appear to be limited to 8 cores. They may not be able to achieve "cool" as they are 14nm. Not sure I believe all their claims.
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Robert



Joined: 29 Nov 2006
Posts: 352
Location: Manchester

PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 5:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How many cores does the Zen 3 have?
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LitusSaxonicum



Joined: 23 Aug 2005
Posts: 2187
Location: Yateley, Hants, UK

PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Robert,

Zen3 is a family. The 5950 has 16 cores, 32 threads, the 5900 has 12 cores, 24 threads, and so on down to the 5600 with 6 cores and 12 threads.

It seems that we are more likely to see more cores than faster clockspeeds.

Eddie
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Robert



Joined: 29 Nov 2006
Posts: 352
Location: Manchester

PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And which one are you hoping to get?
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JohnCampbell



Joined: 16 Feb 2006
Posts: 2239
Location: Sydney

PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2020 1:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Robert,

I now have a i7-8700k (6Core,12thread) and am hoping to get a 5900X (12Core,24thread).
At 10 threads, I am seeing memory bottlenecking for large arrays, with reduced AVX efficiency. It will be interesting to see if more cache helps.
Need to get a new cpu first, as not generally available !
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Robert



Joined: 29 Nov 2006
Posts: 352
Location: Manchester

PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2020 9:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

64MB of L3 cache - more memory than the whole of Salford Software when I joined!
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LitusSaxonicum



Joined: 23 Aug 2005
Posts: 2187
Location: Yateley, Hants, UK

PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2020 11:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting. You were lucky. (Cue Monty Python sketch here.)
My first experience of a 'decent' mainframe was an Elliot/NCR 4120 which had 24k of 24bit words. I later used an IBM 1130 which had less, and some CDC machines which had 64k of 60 bit words. As time went by, I had access to larger machines, culminating in a terminal-access VAX with 512k bytes. After that, I used PCs starting with an Apricot which starting from 256k (of about half usable) I ramped up to 896k (no 640k limit) and then a 286 with 960k usable.
When I got to a 386, DBOS screwed up my machine because it was incompatible with Apricot's own DOS extender.
By the time I had a 486 machine with 16Mb of RAM, nothing needed to be overlaid, and that was the first sweet spot, giving more memory than many mainframes of the time.
Currently, I have 32Gb, 16Gb, and 8Gb machines. All of which are overkill for 32 bit FTN95, which runs happily on a 2Gb laptop, although only with 32 bit Windows 10. The second sweet spot occurred initially at 1Gb and Windows XP/7 because around then, say nearly 20 years ago, ClearWin+ became easy to use - when it no longer required DBOS as well.
Frankly, while using multiple cores in an FTN95 program is difficult, it's only power users like JohnC and Dan who need those multicore machines. I prefer the better roundoff precision of the x87 to the speed improvements with SSE (if there are any for what I do) and once software runs with no perceptible lag, further speed improvements are a bit pointless (JC and DR excepted, of course).

Eddie
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Robert



Joined: 29 Nov 2006
Posts: 352
Location: Manchester

PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2020 7:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
64MB of L3 cache - more memory than the whole of Salford Software when I joined!


I was referring to a year after FTN77/386 had shipped!
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